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Replacement Storms for Vintage Casement Windows

Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 1:05 pm
by SandyC6573
H John,
We have the original wood casement windows in our 1952 ranch. We love the windows and are in the process of repairing and restoring them. The issue is with the interior aluminum storms that clip into a rabbit in the frame of the sash. The intent seems to be that they are semi-permanent only to be removed for cleaning. They leak and several attempts to seal them either with caulk beads or jamming weather stripping into the tight squeeze has been fruitless. If I put plastic over the interior of the window, they'll stay dry which leads us to believe it is indeed the storm. Even with windows we have fully restored without the plastic, they condensate. I've attached a couple of pics of the mechanism, hoping for some insight into how we can repair or replace with out having to purchase new sashes.
Thanks,
Sandy

Re: Replacement Storms for Vintage Casement Windows

Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2018 7:17 pm
by johnleeke
Hi Sandy, thanks for coming over to the windows Forum. OK, let's use the good old Q&A method here.

Where are you located?

Have you identified which brand and specific product the windows are? They look like they might be the Andersen brand. Look for a logo etched in the corner of the pane or numbers on the hardware.

>>They leak<<

What is leaking, from where to where?

>>If I put plastic over the interior of the window<<

Can you show me a photo with the plastic installed?

>>they condensate<<

Where is the condensation appearing? (inside or outside of primary glass, inside or outside of storm glass, inside or outside of plastic, ???)

Re: Replacement Storms for Vintage Casement Windows

Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 12:41 pm
by SandyC6573
Sounds Good John.
See below:

Where are you located? Mid-Michigan

Have you identified which brand and specific product the windows are?
They look like they might be the Andersen brand. Look for a logo etched in the corner of the pane or numbers on the hardware.
No luck on marks. I think all the glass has been replaced at some point as well as the cranks. All external hardware has been painted over and
there is nothing on the locks.
I believe they are Anderson as well based on my research into replacement sashes.

>>They leak<<

What is leaking, from where to where?
Warm air I'm assuming, Between the storm and the external glass. Once the sun hits the south facing windows, most of the moisture will clear up.
North windows stay wet most of the time on days when outside temp drops below 40 or so.

>>If I put plastic over the interior of the window<<

Can you show me a photo with the plastic installed?
Plastic is attached with double stick tape to window trim, covering entire interior side of the window.

>>they condensate<<

Where is the condensation appearing? (inside or outside of primary glass, inside or outside of storm glass, inside or outside of plastic, ???)
inside on the primary glass and inside on storm glass, nothing on the plastic

Re: Replacement Storms for Vintage Casement Windows

Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 4:41 pm
by SandyC6573
When I say inside of storm, I mean room side. Main glass condensates between inside and storm.
No condensation on plastic.

Re: Replacement Storms for Vintage Casement Windows

Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 4:50 pm
by johnleeke
Sandy,

The evidence strongly suggests the type and details of these windows are simply not capable of preventing condensation in your climate. But, I suggest accepting these details, sashes and interior glass storms; and continuing with your work of restoring them, removing any heavy paint buildup that might be effecting the fit and operation of the sashes. Is there any rubber, plastic or metal weatherstrip? What is its condition?

It looks like they have been allowing condensation a long time , considering the peeling paint on the interior stool. Have you found any decayed wood in the stools, bottom rails of the sashes, or lower parts of of the frame?

Consider adding interior air panels for use during cold weather.
viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5208
Since your experience was good with the heat-shrink plastic, just go a little further down that path. Putting the plastic on a light wooden frame so it can be reused can save dollars over the long haul. In your case the frames would require a little extra detailing to get around the hardware, I could help you with that here at the forum if you need it. I suggest trying one out over the middle sash and see how it works to prevent condensation. I've found that an air panel probably doubles the energy efficiency of a window. You have to come up with an effective seal around the edges of the panel, I show several types at the link above.

Re: Replacement Storms for Vintage Casement Windows

Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 5:00 pm
by SandyC6573
Ok, I'll check it out. We've made those in the past as well for a different home we lived in, 1910 Craftsman with double hung and outside alumimum storms. I was hoping for a different solution.
What about having double or single pane glass inserts made and just glaze them in permanently?

Re: Replacement Storms for Vintage Casement Windows

Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 5:20 pm
by johnleeke
>>What about having double pane glass inserts made and just glaze them in permanently?<<
Disadvantages to consider:
-- the seal of the inserts may only last from 5 to 20 years, and then they may begin to fog up and need to be replaced
-- the existing sash may need to be routed out to get the inserts to fit, weakening the sash
-- still needs to be tested, and they may not solve the condensation

Re: Replacement Storms for Vintage Casement Windows

Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 8:18 pm
by SandyC6573
Thanks John.
You've given us a few things to consider.